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Post by phatman113 on Apr 17, 2023 21:35:49 GMT
I agree with the other comments and thoughts that the higher PSI is appealing, I'm not as concerned about the forgetfulness part (though, maybe I should be?! ) but I do agree that anything that can be done to save us from ourselves is a good thing... Will it be easily removable? One of the benefits of the submersible ones would be adding and removing the whole tank doesn't really have a dangly bit attached to it to juggle as well (and worry about damaging). If the pump is external, it should be easily removable in case I don't need it, or want to install/remove the tank...
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Post by shift4 on Apr 17, 2023 21:36:23 GMT
I vote for the external, on demand pump if that means higher PSI and less overall power consumption. Yeah I have to agree. At first I was so focused on the camping portion that the sprayer use was an afterthought at best, but the more I thought about having the tank available for day to day use...man there are just so many more situations where a decently powerful sprayer would come in handy. I go fishing with my buddies out in Port Isabelle and when we get back and have the boat loaded it would be super handy for cleaning fish. I have been at a remote worksite and had small fires start from welding sparks several times. Not something you want to crack open a $50 fire extinguisher for. I loved running our dogs at the beach but rinsing them off for the ride home with a water bottle was all but pointless--a sprayer would be AWESOME there. I can imagine somebody with a remote "garden" reading this and thinking...yeah...YEAH =) Living in the PNW with lots of rain means that trails are often muddy. Being able to give my dogs a quick cleaning before loading them back into the truck would be amazing.
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Post by BoxGods on Apr 17, 2023 21:39:50 GMT
Yeah I have to agree. At first I was so focused on the camping portion that the sprayer use was an afterthought at best, but the more I thought about having the tank available for day to day use...man there are just so many more situations where a decently powerful sprayer would come in handy. I go fishing with my buddies out in Port Isabelle and when we get back and have the boat loaded it would be super handy for cleaning fish. I have been at a remote worksite and had small fires start from welding sparks several times. Not something you want to crack open a $50 fire extinguisher for. I loved running our dogs at the beach but rinsing them off for the ride home with a water bottle was all but pointless--a sprayer would be AWESOME there. I can imagine somebody with a remote "garden" reading this and thinking...yeah...YEAH =) Living in the PNW with lots of rain means that trails are often muddy. Being able to give my dogs a quick cleaning before loading them back into the truck would be amazing. Yeah there are times where I felt pretty guilty for not taking them because I just don't want the sand/mud in the truck.
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Post by BoxGods on Apr 17, 2023 21:45:53 GMT
I agree with the other comments and thoughts that the higher PSI is appealing, I'm not as concerned about the forgetfulness part (though, maybe I should be?! ) but I do agree that anything that can be done to save us from ourselves is a good thing... Will it be easily removable? One of the benefits of the submersible ones would be adding and removing the whole tank doesn't really have a dangly bit attached to it to juggle as well (and worry about damaging). If the pump is external, it should be easily removable in case I don't need it, or want to install/remove the tank... "Easily" is relative of course. Anything that requires you to reach that deep into the frunk is going to be a bit more effort. I have been considering some sort of QD or slip fit installation, but the potential issue there is the higher pressure--you are going to want solid leak free connections. The pumps not all that fragile so setting a few bas of groceries or similar on it wouldn't be an issue. You don't want to chuck your bowling bag down on it from 2 feet away but for the most part I don't think it would be an issue.
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Post by seattlesteve on Apr 18, 2023 3:01:06 GMT
I, too, find the idea of higher pressure appealing. Rinse off boots, hose down dog...the functionality of a higher-pressure hose would be great.
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Post by BoxGods on Apr 18, 2023 17:05:50 GMT
I agree with the other comments and thoughts that the higher PSI is appealing, I'm not as concerned about the forgetfulness part (though, maybe I should be?! ) but I do agree that anything that can be done to save us from ourselves is a good thing... Will it be easily removable? One of the benefits of the submersible ones would be adding and removing the whole tank doesn't really have a dangly bit attached to it to juggle as well (and worry about damaging). If the pump is external, it should be easily removable in case I don't need it, or want to install/remove the tank... I did a very basic test fit in CAD to give you guys an idea of where I am thinking of putting the on Demand pump if we end up going that route. I also tinkered with a magnetic hold down with slip rings for the intake side of the pump so it would be a fast/easy tool free removal. I think I might be able to make that work. Will need to test it of course, but basically you just reach in and pull the pump off the top of the tank and then screw a cap on. About as simple as it gets.
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jcreviston
General
El Cap R1T Feb. 1, 2023
Posts: 28
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Post by jcreviston on Apr 18, 2023 20:30:27 GMT
Forgive me if this was addressed elsewhere but it looks like you moved the access ports to the passenger side of the tank back in November when you made the structural revisions. Can you refresh us on the rationale for this modification? I'm concerned that I'll have a cord running across the frunk to access the 12v outlet. Thanks and otherwise this looks great!
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Post by phatman113 on Apr 18, 2023 20:34:41 GMT
I think this was to put it closer to the camp kitchen to serve as a secondary water source for that...
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Post by phatman113 on Apr 18, 2023 20:37:45 GMT
Forgive me if this was addressed elsewhere but it looks like you moved the access ports to the passenger side of the tank back in November when you made the structural revisions. Can you refresh us on the rationale for this modification? I'm concerned that I'll have a cord running across the frunk to access the 12v outlet. Thanks and otherwise this looks great! rivian-aftermarket.proboards.com/post/29/thread
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Post by BoxGods on Apr 18, 2023 20:50:26 GMT
Forgive me if this was addressed elsewhere but it looks like you moved the access ports to the passenger side of the tank back in November when you made the structural revisions. Can you refresh us on the rationale for this modification? I'm concerned that I'll have a cord running across the frunk to access the 12v outlet. Thanks and otherwise this looks great! There were several reasons but the most notable was having the fill hoses on the same side as the trucks charge port access--or rather moving the tank ports so they were not on the same side as the trucks charge port.
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Post by agame32 on Apr 18, 2023 21:15:52 GMT
Awesome work and bummed I missed the first run. I’ve emailed my interest and please put me on any waitlist for units that become available.
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Post by BoxGods on Apr 18, 2023 21:52:04 GMT
Awesome work and bummed I missed the first run. I’ve emailed my interest and please put me on any waitlist for units that become available. If you email Marsha HERE she can still take your reservation for the first run right up until the mold tooling arrives at the factory and we have to lock down the run.
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Post by phatdaddy on Apr 19, 2023 4:13:05 GMT
Higher pressure would be my vote for my uses. But I was hoping with the internal pump that it would provide a relatively flat loading surface on top of the tank. Ideally I had hoped the the tank could be contained (and hidden) completely below the frunk lower shelf so that the shelf could remain in place (one less thing to store in the garage) as I would probably leave the tank in place (empty) when not being used (the tank being another thing not stored in the garage). So although I would like the higher PSI an external pump might provide, I don’t love the ‘attached dongle’ look that might necessitate, especially if it means not being able to lay the frunk shelf down flat whenever the tank is in vehicle. I recognize that when in active use with hoses and power wires attached, the frunk shelf will probably have to be removed or folded back regardless of pump type. If the external pump can be made - as mentioned - “easily removable” such that the frunk shelf could be laid flat when the external pump part is NOT attached, that would work OK for me… depending of course on exactly how “easily removable“… once I find a good place to store the (wet? drained?) pump part (and hoses) within the frunk. But ultimately I am on board with the group and will deal with whatever design constraints are required to make this happen. Thanks for soliciting feedback.
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Post by BoxGods on Apr 19, 2023 11:27:37 GMT
Higher pressure would be my vote for my uses. But I was hoping with the internal pump that it would provide a relatively flat loading surface on top of the tank. Ideally I had hoped the the tank could be contained (and hidden) completely below the frunk lower shelf so that the shelf could remain in place (one less thing to store in the garage) as I would probably leave the tank in place (empty) when not being used (the tank being another thing not stored in the garage). So although I would like the higher PSI an external pump might provide, I don’t love the ‘attached dongle’ look that might necessitate, especially if it means not being able to lay the frunk shelf down flat whenever the tank is in vehicle. I recognize that when in active use with hoses and power wires attached, the frunk shelf will probably have to be removed or folded back regardless of pump type. If the external pump can be made - as mentioned - “easily removable” such that the frunk shelf could be laid flat when the external pump part is NOT attached, that would work OK for me… depending of course on exactly how “easily removable“… once I find a good place to store the (wet? drained?) pump part (and hoses) within the frunk. But ultimately I am on board with the group and will deal with whatever design constraints are required to make this happen. Thanks for soliciting feedback. Thank you for taking the time to share your well thought out use case so clearly. I Originally started this with the idea of having the tank fit under the shelf but in practice there is no way to do that without drilling holes in the shelf for the hose connections. I should state that as "no practical way". Some people would be fine with drilling a few 1.5" holes in the shelf--I would be--but most were very much against it and I 100% understand why. If I recess the fill ports into the top of the tank for an "open shelf" approach they end up lowering the maximum fill level (you can't fill above the highest vent level) about 1.25 to 1.5 inches and because that decrease is at the top of the tank at the largest surface area, it is a substantial loss of water volume. As an example, just using arbitrary numbers, if the bottom of the tank is 36" x 6" and the top is 48" x 12" that's a loss of 270 cubic inches at the bottom vs 864 at the top. There are 231 cubic inches in a gallon so you lose about 3.7 gallons of storage or 25% of the available capacity--IOW not insubstantial. Almost without exception, (at least from my experience) the best camping spots are usually dry, so having enough water to get to the really good places is important. One other item that caused an issue was the magnets Rivian uses to hold the shelf open. These are mounted to the bottom so they protrude down into the space under the shelf occupied by the tank. I originally designed it so the handle openings were positioned in such a way that the magnets fit into that space. Then Rivian moved them. Twice. I'm not knocking Rivian in the least as I know they are working their butts off to simplify production and lower costs where they can. On balance, the shelf folds flat and takes up very little space if you're storing it, and is very easily removed/returned from/to the truck, tool free. I think it would also be fine just leaving it in the truck folded up, though I haven't tested this driving around as I don't have my truck yet. I know none of that directly resolves some of the compromises you mentioned for your specific use case, but I wanted you to know the rationale behind the design choices I made--none of them are arbitrary.
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Post by BoxGods on Apr 19, 2023 11:50:32 GMT
Quick update on the first On Demand pump sample. The pressure difference was noticeable for sure--not earth shattering by any stretch but clearly the more desirable option if at all possible. Power consumption was 4 amps or 48 watts vs 72 for the larger 6 amp submersible, so again the more desirable option if possible. On the down side, much louder than the db numbers stated by the manufacturer. Way too loud IMO--everyone would be complaining about the noise. It was loud in a fairly noisy shop so out in a quiet forest it would be especially grating. I'm pretty sensitive to noise--I love the quiet--but I also understand that mechanical things do need to make SOME sound. This was well beyond that. I have several other sample pump models coming, hopefully one of them will have more practical noise levels. I'm also ordering one of these to test as they claim it is about as loud as a typical household fan. They MAY be being a little sneaky in the marketing as they link that claim to the motor itself--not the entire pump. We shall see. It is also capped at 40 PSI and not 60, but has higher flow at 5.6 L/pm so maybe a better balance between flow and PSI. 4.5A at max so good there. It has a housing around the pump head which adds a tiny bit of bulk but might help with noise reduction. Seaflo is a well known brand in the RV and boating community and they sell pumps and replacement parts right on Amazon and are stocked at most RV and boating shops, which is another plus. If those turn out to be too loud as well I would want to go with the larger 12VDC 6A submersible.
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